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Beware, this is a book excerpt rather than a standalone blog post, so it ends on a cliffhanger. Still a fun read.

Hopefully, this comes as no more of a spoiler than revealing the Titanic sinks at the end of the movie... but, everything Mark Klein revealed in 2006 (and that Snowden revealed in 2014) is still happening daily - along with much, much worse. And just this week congress is acting to further extend the secret extra-expanded FISA powers we don't even know about.

U.S. Senator Ron Wyden is on the Senate Intelligence Committee and obviously can't reveal the details but has been clear it's gotten very, very bad (starting from 'worse than Snowden'). And Wyden doesn't strike me as the excitable type prone to exaggeration. So... I've concluded I should imagine the worst possible surveillance abuses and assume it's even worse.


its been going on for decades... I don't know if there is an answer to this problem

Encrypt everything, all the time, everywhere, use quantum hardened encryption wherever possible.

This does not work if your communication enpoint is the same as your encryption endpoint.

Or you don't control your key material.

Or your tech supply chain.

Or leave your device unattended.

Or aren't susceptible to the same "five dollar wrench" attacks used by certain in-person Bitcoin wallet thievestgat are also available to state actors.

I could go on...


Ron Wyden is my favorite senator and a great example of why Oregon is such a based/amazing state.

There's more info about the outcome in [1]. Long story short, the US government passed a law (whilst this case was being litigated) that let AT&T off the hook.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hepting_v._AT%26T


While I was upset to hear how that ended, it's also unfair to expect a company to refuse when the government shows up with guns, takes over a part of your offices, and tells you to stay out of their way and never tell anyone what they are doing or else you'll be killed or sent to a secret torture prison for the rest of your life.

That's not a situation that's supposed to happen in a free country, but here we are. If you're handed a gag order by the federal government and can't even tell your lawyers about what happened what options does a company have? How many CEOs and low level employees should we expect to volunteer to have their lives destroyed by refusing to cooperate with the government's illegal surveillance schemes?

At&t may not have been coerced quite that aggressively, but these kinds of problems need to be addressed by people other than the private companies who are themselves victims of government oppression. Having said that, not every company is a totally unwilling participant either. There are companies who are happy to make a lot of money by selling our private data to the government. ISPs and phone companies even bill police departments for things like wiretaps and access to online portals where they can collect customer's data. State surveillance (legal or otherwise) shouldn't be allowed to become a revenue stream for private corporations. In fact it should be costly.

Considering the massively disproportionate amount of influence corporations have over our government (mostly as a result of their own bribes) it's tempting to want to make compliance so costly to companies that they're compelled to try to use some of that influence to stop or limit domestic surveillance by the state, but honestly I doubt that even they have enough power to stop it. Snowden showed us that even congress doesn't have the power to regulate these agencies. The head of the NSA, under oath, lied right to their faces by denying that their illegal wiretapping scheme even existed. You can't regulate something you aren't allowed to know exists. He also faced zero consequences for those lies which tells us that he's basically untouchable.

Obama was elected on campaign promises that he would end the NSA's domestic surveillance programs. Obama was an expert on constitutional law and taught courses on it at the University of Chicago. He spoke out passionately about how unconstitutional and dangerous such programs were. After he was elected his stance quickly changed. He not only started publicly praising the NSA, he actually expanded their surveillance powers. Maybe the NSA showed him a bunch of top secret evidence that scared him enough to make him willing to accept the dangers of their surveillance despite knowing the risks and unconstitutionality. Maybe the NSA strong-armed him. Either way, not even the US president had the power to stop the NSA. It's pretty unreasonable to expect that AT&T would.


There's a reason J. Edgar Hoover held power for 48 years.

Kennedy wanted to "break the CIA into a thousand pieces"[1] and had a trusted brother as Attorney General to help with the task. And we learn 70 years later that Oswald was a CIA asset[2]. It's enough for even a President to sit up and take notice.

1: https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/sites/default/files/2025-03/2025-0...

2: https://www.newsweek.com/new-documents-shed-light-cias-conne...


Cliffhanger! Did it end with millions of Americans being freed forever from government surveillance?!?

j/k It's a good excerpt, and makes me want to read the book.


I've put that detail in the title above - perhaps it will help nudge the thread ontopicward.

> Our entire economy is built on scientific advancement and advantage.

Devil's advocate: Only productivity gains, not the entire economy, are built on scientific advancement. But wages haven't grown with productivity in half a century, so the loss of scientific advantage won't affect wage growth, therefore the economy will be fine.

(I know it's not convincing, but it's the best I can conjure.)


Seems like your advocacy of the devil still supports the parent comment’s speculation of this being a cultural revolution appealing to workers who have been “left behind” (e.g. coal miners who didn’t learn how to code).

The article charts a Nature survey that shows "percent trusting the scientific community" was sub-50% for both D's and R's from 1985-2015. That's more interesting and concerning to me than the relatively recent divergence in partisian opinion. I'd wager we return to that status quo within 10 years, but even that state seems dire.

I think that is the Nixon effect followed up my the messaged opinion of the Regan administration that the government shouldn't be trusted despite doing 1000s of things that should earn a little bit of trust.

If you're the type of person who checks the comments on a post with this kind of headline, then you probably also want to (re-)watch the 2 minute highlight reel of Mark's backyard meat-smoking party. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBxTEoseZak


Israel violated the 2024 ceasefire over 10,000 times [0], not counting all the ones since Feb. 28. I guess this time they're not satisfied with having only 50 "freebies" a day.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Israel%E2%80%93Lebanon_ce...


Have Israel ever respected a ceasefire?


Has Hamas or Hezbollah?


You seem to be implying Israel is no better than a terrorist group.


Not only is it no better, it is significantly worse.


Hamas is the (originally elected by the people) government of Gaza. Hezbollah is a partner of and inside Lebanon's government.

In addition, both parties are who Israel was nominally in a ceasefire with. So extremely relevant to the discussion about Israel and ceasefires and not random whataboutism.

You seem to be implying discussion should be waived away if a counter party is both a government and a terrorist organization.


Not sure why you're replying to me?

I'm not the one comparing Israel, Hamas, and Hezbollah.

Though next time I'll put terrorist group in quotes, as everyone has their own opinion.


[flagged]


What's my argument? He's the one that used them for comparison.


[flagged]


Are you sure? The ADL says Jewish Voice for Peace are antisemitic: https://www.adl.org/resources/backgrounder/jewish-voice-peac...


Less times than Israel, and usually in response.

Israel has done more terrorism than Hamas.


Not only that, but Israel financed Hamas to politically destabilize Palestine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_support_for_Hamas


why is that relevant? Israel is a nation state, the others are 'terrorist groups'. are they equivalent? your response seems to imply that.

Interesting.


Israel is not a nation state but a western colony in Palestine (like Tibet is a Chinese colony, or Algeria was for france).


Hamas is the government in Gaza who the ceasefire was with and whose acts it was contingent on.

Hezbollah is part of the government in Lebanon and who the ceasefire was with and whose acts in was contingent on.

The relevance is pretty obvious.

'why are do you want to include both sides (including the actual governments on both sides) in a discussion about ceasefire' is a wild take.


They have a far better track record. The other side constantly lies and violates every rule.


Yes


Textbook whataboutism.


Israel would not be doing this if not for the continuous attacks from those jihadist groups (well funded by Iran). But you know that.


The Nakba was not provoked by jihadist groups, it was provoked by colonial invaders. The victimization narrative never worked.


Ceasefire include removing Hizballa from Lebanon, but facts doesn't matter for terror supporters


> or just ignoring the laws, and illegally reporting from dangerous yellow or red zones

I skimmed Wikipedia [1] but couldn't find any mention of laws in Ukraine that forbid reporting from certain areas. I see laws forbidding statements of support for Russia, and laws enabling censorship. Maybe I've misunderstood: are you referring to anti-trespassing laws in general, and not specifically about reporters?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_the_press_in_Ukrain...


I meant rules for journalists specifically; I'm surprised the article doesn't mention it. I think this is a good summary from https://cpj.org/2023/03/new-ukrainian-army-regulations-limit...

> The rules bar journalists from working in so-called “red zones” deemed most dangerous, and require a military press officer’s escort to work in less dangerous yellow zones. Journalists can work freely in green zones.


No, this is a different strike. Please read the NYT article you linked more carefully.

> The Feb. 28 attack occurred the same day as a U.S. Tomahawk cruise missile struck a school in the city of Minab, several hundred miles away, killing 175 people. In the case of Lamerd, though, it involved a weapon that had been untested in combat.


Crap, you're right. My apologies.


I assume this is an infuriatingly subtle parody, because:

> Why can't you just celebrate this good thing?

reads like <font size=2> /s </font>.


Yep, it's a profoundly stupid thing to say. Maybe a bot comment?


You seem to be unaware that the whole world doesn't share your bubble's political opinions.


Another situation where bad actors benefit. From the article:

> What really interests Cian, who has published research[1] exploring how audiences tend to have less trust in media outlets that are transparent about their AI use, is the fact that the Post disclosed its use of algorithmic pricing at all. “If you ask people [whether they] want transparency on what’s behind your pricing strategy, people say ‘yes,'” he says. “But what we found in my research is a paradox, in the sense that people think that they want to know, but once they know, the reaction is worse than not knowing.”

> [1] https://ideas.darden.virginia.edu/AI-disclosure-dilemma


> But what we found in my research is a paradox, in the sense that people think that they want to know, but once they know, the reaction is worse than not knowing.

"People said they wanted to know if companies were putting feces into chocolate, but once they know, they stop buying that 'chocolate'. The reaction is worse than not knowing! What a paradox! The revealed preference is that consumers want companies to secretly include feces. I am a professor."


It shouldn't be surprising that a company who might be using a scummy pricing strategy gets less blow-back than one who comes right out and brazenly says they are using a scummy pricing strategy. When the action is bad, admitting to it and continuing to do it shows contempt.

It's as though you caught a thief rifling through your pockets and they just looked you in the eye and said, "You caught me. I'm not stopping. What are you going to do about it chump?"


Note the way he brushes off his own attorney's objections, not even looking at or reacting to her, while he discusses why someone who's mass-canceling grants doesn't need any grant-writing experience. Total disdain for any kind of expertise, whether academic or legal.


I was curious about this from another video in relation to this case. I have no legal training, but I think there's no reason the witness would refuse to answer when counsel objects. There's no judge in the room as far as I know. The court handles the objections after the fact, I think, which could potentially have implications on how the trial proceeds.

Again, I have never practiced law, so I may be entirely incorrect. Also, I am not defending the witness or their actions.


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