I help with my kid a lot, and I'm remote so I do it around the clock. I take contact naps, change every diaper, watch her for periods of time so my wife is free.
my wife doesn't work. and she didn't work before we had a baby. because one of our salaries was enough, so instead we work less. and again due to remote work, work has barely been top 5 in my life focus areas for the last decade.
they're just holding it wrong.. what model are they using? they should make sure they're on Opus 4.5+. That was a stepwise improvement and was when AI coding clearly became the futureₖₑₖ
These are people that lucked into working at FAANG 10 years ago and been riding the coattails since. Highly incompetent people dictating how we should all work.
their CEO has been shouting from the rooftops that programming is dead. ofc that would ripple down the org chart and result in a culture of bad programming.
That is exactly the impression I get from the claude code team, and by extension some of their recent launches like Cowork and Design. And of course with the growth team or whoever is in charge of the subscription and quota side of things.
They just do the basic experiment -> ship workflow over and over again, doing whatever optimizes their product in the short term, and never seem to step back and think about the full long-term impact of their changes. They evidently seem to not even consider immediate regressions or negative blowback from users if it's not within the area of expertise of the guy who ships the change.
That is despite their other teams (especially alignment) having a track record of being fairly well thought-out and intelligent.
To the guys at Anthropic's product teams, every problem is a data science problem that you slap an A/B test onto, and they seem to think that the A/B test is all that's needed, and actual verification and thinking things through is overrated af. That's what leads to countless regressions in Claude Code as well as removing claude code from the pro plan in their product page for a few hours (lol).
Tbf, their harness was surprisingly ahead of the curve for most of the last year..
Are this point, the difference is mostly made up by issues like the OP has, so you're likely better off using eg pi (-agent) and writing your own custom skills and extensions (or any of the other harnesses the providers create, even copilot-cli has gotten decent nowadays)
> Tbf, their harness was surprisingly ahead of the curve for most of the last year..
Do a `s/harness/software` on that statement, and that is going to describe most companies shipping AI written software.
> this point, the difference is mostly made up by issues like the OP has, so you're likely better off using eg pi (-agent) and writing your own custom skills and extensions (or any of the other harnesses the providers create, even copilot-cli has gotten decent nowadays)
They (AI-written software) are all going to be ahead in some way, until they aren't because they hit the practical limits of codebase size that can be reasonably understood by an LLM.
Codex, OpenCode and Pi are all good. I've been using Codex a lot and it's much more stable software than CC. Claude Code was once a leader, back in the hazy days of December/January, but now has a lot of competition.
What a joke. If "Anthropic is just a bunch of script kiddies" then everyone is, considering dozens of billions pored into beating their models yet they're still the go-to for coding and have been for quite a while now. Just a nonsensical thing to say.
They got dethroned by some random Chinese company this month again. I don't think they are script kiddies but I think they have a moat on gpus.
The US is doing everything to make it so hard for other countries to compete. And yet, with everything stacked against all these other companies, and with way way less money and way less fancy researchers they get beat over and over again. Usually by companies who AI isn't even their main product.
Actually Alibaba dethroned sonnet with a model that's like 1/100th the size and can run on commodity hardware this month too. So they do look kind of silly...
Definitely not script kiddies, but the way the researchers get managed makes them look goofy and sloppy and not interested in benefitting the consumer.
What is this reply even, what’s wrong with the vibe coding community? They have such ridiculous takes, it reminds me a lot of the extreme stances from the gaming community. Terminology also seems to come from there, “nerfing” etc.
Vibe coding, like Web3 before it (like Web 2.0 before it, like the dotcom boom before that - what preceded?) - harnesses the kind of focused attention with which gamers hook their brains into portals to virtual worlds - and directs all that bargain-basement wetware compute towards some obscured "real-world" goal instead. (See also: CADT development.)
Hyperscale these very inefficient but very dependable almost-not-efforts, and you beat the more efficient approaches. See also: evolutionary algorithms, autoresearch, price dumping; "attention is all you need", which though a legit piece of mathemagic always sounded to me like a rehash of that old adage, "all you need is love" (pejorative).
Really, "real world" is a consensus; we don't generally observe balamatoms or even balamolecules, we reason in terms of material objects' socially constructed balameanings and interrelations. Therefore, by redirecting sufficient attention to some thing labeled "unrealistic", we can remove that label; by this technique, a sufficiently large collective actor can quite literally, and quite directly, change the world. Without asking anyone, least of all me!
I think a lot of non-vibe-coding types also hold similar opinions -- in fact they might dislike Anthropic products even more, given that they (however few they might be) choose not to use them.
Why the insults/hostility? Why call them script-kiddies? Why the inflated egos?
How do you know what testing procedures they use? Do you honestly think they're running some kind of Ralph loop without any testing and just ship whatever looks the coolest? Really ?
> How do you know what testing procedures they use?
We don’t, but we can see the end result, so we know whatever they do isn’t adequate and it suggests they value shipping fast over quality or even listening to customer feedback.
> Do you honestly think they're running some kind of Ralph loop without any testing and just ship whatever looks the coolest? Really ?
No, but given how sharply the quality has been dropping over the past few months and how it suspiciously coincided with the time they admitted that Claude code is now 100% vibe coded, it certainly doesn’t feel too far off.
I’ve personally found the code that the AI writes, even this week (ie not some old models from months ago) to be shockingly shoddy. I’ve rewritten some AI code (created via spec driven development and a workflow that includes planning and refactoring) by hand and I’ve been very conscious of the amount of micro-design-changes I as a human make where the AI just blows forward shoehorning a solution into the design. My implementation happens b has adjusted and shifted many times to insure clear and performant logic, while the AI commits to an approach early and applied whatever brute force is necessary to make it work.
I’ve also asked it to write various tests for me or to make isolated changes and quite frankly the code was just not very good. Working, but convoluted. Even with guidance and iteration, it’s still not on a human level.
So it’s not hard to see that if you have an application as large and complex as Claude code and you let the AI do it all, that it’s going to be a mess.
I’m not against using AI for development, but you have to be realistic about its capabilities. I feel like this is where they “got high on their own supply” and are blinded to the AI’s shortcomings and failures.
They’ve said themselves that Claude code is 100% vibe coded now. That certainly meets the criteria of “script kiddies” and “high on their own supply”. The negative connotations are there on purpose because of the bugs and issues that these products have, something which presumably they wouldn’t have if there was human oversight and acknowledgement that the AI isn’t infallible.
> They’ve said themselves that Claude code is 100% vibe coded now. That certainly meets the criteria of “script kiddies”
That's not what script kiddies are at all.
> The negative connotations are there on purpose because of the bugs and issues that these products have, something which presumably they wouldn’t have if there was human oversight and acknowledgement that the AI isn’t infallible.
That's a big assumption, given that Anthropic is also currently growing by more than 3x per quarter. Maybe the problem is more complicated and we don't know everything, and they're also just simply suffering from growth pains?
Sure it is. The new age of script kiddies: they don’t know how to do it for themselves, but they can run a script (or tell the AI to) to do it for them.
> That's a big assumption
We can only see the results, which are more and more bugs, problems, regressions, etc. That’s not normal behavior. Yes all we can do is speculate, we don’t know the real reasons for the issues, but it’s clear there are issues and they appear to be getting worse.
I don’t understand the hostility and insulting tones being reasonable now.
The comment is not at all just saying “their usage of their own AI is causing these issues”, it’s just a lot of hostility, I don’t see the value of these kind of insults.
lol "hostility" - they sell a very high profile product and the issues seem to reflect bad engineering culture. therefore, I say their culture smells bad.
I just want you to know that I read over this thread and you are obviously completely right. This sort of incurious, immature stance is something I've seen become the norm on HN over the last few years, particularly when it comes to AI.
I didn't say anything like that! Like I said I just don't think that this opinion is somehow associated with "vibe coders"; if anything I'd expect the opposite.
Tacoma, WA is pretty choice. Got a 3k sqft house in the bougie burbs for $500k in 2020 for sub 3% lmao. imagine not pouncing on that as a seattlite. you probably live in a 1920s trap house for $800k BUT you're technically still "in Seattle" (LOL)
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